Courage, Compassion, and Difficult People
Some people just drain you. You’ve tried avoiding them, reasoning with them, even killing them with kindness—nothing sticks. If you’re being honest, you’re either walking on eggshells or keeping your distance. There’s a better way, and it starts with understanding what’s actually going on.
In this episode of the Everyday Disciple Podcast, we’re going to break down the four types of difficult people, the “thing behind the thing” driving each one, and how the gospel gives you something better than tolerance or avoidance—a path toward real connection, even with the hardest people in your life.
In This Episode You’ll Learn:
- The four types of difficult people and what’s actually driving their behavior
- Why difficult people present one of the clearest gospel opportunities in your life
- How to understand “the thing behind the thing” so you stop reacting and start responding
- Why you might be on someone else’s “difficult person” list — and what to do about it
From this episode:
“When we take the time necessary to gently address a person in a way that they can hear and receive, a bond of trust is built that can change how they act and how we respond to them. When you listen, ask good questions, and seek to understand ‘the thing behind the thing’, it is always a gospel issue that leads to any of us being difficult or argumentative.”
Each week the Big 3 will give you immediate action steps to get you started.
Download today’s BIG 3 right now. Read and think over them again later. You might even want to share them with others…
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Links and Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Coaching and Mentorship in Missional Living by Caesar and his wife Tina
Resources for missional living and group training – Missio Publishing
The Gospel In Everyday Life Workshop Register Now FREE
Transcript
I think the first type of difficult people, and we've all experienced them, are, like, bummers, you know, the, the downers in life.
Speaker:Yeah,
Speaker:man.
Speaker:You know, they're always something negative to say, everything's a drag.
Speaker:They complain and critique and they judge, and they're pretty hard to please.
Speaker:Hm.
Speaker:They're just, they're
Speaker:bummers.
Speaker:I know some.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Uh, so that's one kind of a difficult person.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Second is, um, the know-it-alls, or the, the, we'll call them the better-thans.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:You know?
Speaker:They like to try to impress you.
Speaker:Uh, they'll name-drop or they'll compare what they have or have done to everybody else.
Speaker:They always have a better story or a better way or answer for everything.
Speaker:They're kinda show-offs.
Speaker:Yeah, they wear me out.
Speaker:Kinda like that Bri- Brian Regan thing about the- ... guy who has the social fantasy of- Yeah ... he wished he was one of the people who'd walked on the moon.
Speaker:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker:So people start reeling out their stories.
Speaker:The
Speaker:one-upper.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Exactly.
Speaker:Always ends up, yeah.
Speaker:"I walked on the moon," you know?
Speaker:Um, so the know-it-alls, right?
Speaker:The better-thans.
Speaker:Yep.
Speaker:That's another kind of... They're hard to deal with.
Speaker:Welcome to the Everyday Disciple Podcast, where you'll learn how to live with greater intentionality and an integrated faith that naturally fits into every area of life.
Speaker:In other words, discipleship as a lifestyle.
Speaker:This is the stuff your parents, pastors, and seminary professors probably forgot to tell you.
Speaker:And now, here's your host, Caesar Kalinowski.
Speaker:Hey, Heath.
Speaker:How you feeling, brother?
Speaker:Did you, uh, did you do anything cool this weekend?
Speaker:I didn't.
Speaker:Not much.
Speaker:I mean-
Speaker:You're not out ... I don't,
Speaker:you know.
Speaker:You're
Speaker:not out
Speaker:today.
Speaker:Just
Speaker:the
Speaker:new J- Yeah, Monday's my, Monday's my jam, so.
Speaker:Yeah, well, and- How about you?
Speaker:Well, I'm living the dream.
Speaker:I never work.
Speaker:I mean, I just- That's true ... do this podcast once in a while, and, you know, I'm pretty much, every day's a new day, you know?
Speaker:Still in your pajamas
Speaker:right
Speaker:now.
Speaker:Yeah, I, totally.
Speaker:So, you know, the grandkids come... No, I... It's a work day for me, brother.
Speaker:Always.
Speaker:Every day.
Speaker:It's all good.
Speaker:Hey, let's, uh, let's call out one of our latest reviews from Julie5280, who said, "I'm not a big podcast listener, but..."
Speaker:But
Speaker:"... these podcasts make me feel right at home.
Speaker:Easy to listen to, theologically sound, spiritually relevant, and the hosts have a sense of humor, too." Yeah,
Speaker:yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker:" I've learned a lot.
Speaker:A great addition to your personal Bible study or Sunday sermon."
Speaker:Aw.
Speaker:Thanks.
Speaker:Julie,
Speaker:thanks.
Speaker:Thanks, Julie5280, wherever you are.
Speaker:Appreciate it.
Speaker:Hey, today, we're talking about people in our lives that are just, sometimes can nag us and rub us the wrong way, and I know that we both have people in our lives- Come on, man.
Speaker:You love
Speaker:everybody, perfectly.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Perfect love.
Speaker:Okay, so yeah, right.
Speaker:Uh, I would say that I know that I have those people in my life.
Speaker:I know you have those people in your life, just kinda rub you the wrong way.
Speaker:And I'd actually
Speaker:s- You're on that list when you're not around, but I mean, I mean, when you're not around, you're on that ... Oh.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:I was like, "What are you saying, man?" But I'm, I'm also assuming that every listener of this show probably has those people as well, that just sort of, they nag at us, they gnaw at us, uh,
Speaker:people that- We, we, we kind of jokingly refer to them as the EGRs.
Speaker:Oh, yeah.
Speaker:The extra grace required people.
Speaker:Yeah, you need a little bit of extra grace.
Speaker:You know what I mean?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Some people have heard that term, others have not.
Speaker:Most people chuckle- Yeah ... chortle, you know?
Speaker:There's that humor again, Julie.
Speaker:Um- But yeah, there are people, right?
Speaker:We all have them- Yeah ... where it's just like, yikes, I don't
Speaker:You know, like, does everybody get along with everybody?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:They're the ones that, like, we accidentally-
Speaker:Did Jesus just hang out with everybody and loved it?
Speaker:Eh, I don't know.
Speaker:It's- They're the ones you accidentally not invite to things, like, "Oh, man, I thought you were on the list," and-
Speaker:Nah, you just lied ... your
Speaker:intention
Speaker:didn't
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So now you turned personal preference into d- outright sin.
Speaker:My sin is exposed on this show.
Speaker:Uh, what would you say about that?
Speaker:I, I know you have these people.
Speaker:Well, you know, I, I have to wonder that, and I'm, I'm sure I'm on a bunch of people's list of like, "This guy, he's an EGR." I'm a, I'm a pretty, pretty strong drink there.
Speaker:Um, yeah, I, I have to think that, that that's pretty common, and I see it even in scripture, right?
Speaker:'Cause you just see Paul not get along with Mark at some point, right?
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Sends him off, but then, you know, it's not like Mark is, like, a dirt bag and we never hear from him again.
Speaker:He writes a gospel.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:Paul doesn't get to write a gospel, right?
Speaker:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker:And so I don't think it's, uh, unusual, and I don't think it's even sinful where you just go like, "You know, certain people don't ... You know, I just don't necessarily get along with them." Now, there are some people, though, that are just difficult people.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:They are.
Speaker:They're, you know, there, there ... We all have brokenness.
Speaker:We all have things in our life, and some of them show up socially a lot more than others, right?
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:But there are definitely d- difficult people.
Speaker:Um, and you know, think about the people in your own life and figure out, like, well, what is going on with them?
Speaker:Let, let me start off by saying, um, let me ... I mean, there's probably more ways to categorize this, but let me, let me give you four types of difficult people.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:So at least as we unpack some of this today, we, we can kind of- Kind of know what we're talking about.
Speaker:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker:So I think the first type of difficult people, and we've all experienced them, are, like, bummers, you know, the, the downers in life.
Speaker:Yeah, man.
Speaker:You know, they're always something negative to say, everything's a drag.
Speaker:They complain and critique and they judge, and they're pretty hard to please.
Speaker:Hm.
Speaker:They're just, they're bummers.
Speaker:I know some.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Uh, so that's one kind of a difficult person.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Second is, um, the know-it-alls, or the, the, we'll call them the better-thans.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:You know?
Speaker:They like to try to impress you.
Speaker:Uh, they'll name-drop or they'll compare what they have or have done to everybody else.
Speaker:They always have a better story or a better way or answer for everything.
Speaker:They're kind of show-offs.
Speaker:Yeah, they wear me out.
Speaker:Kind of like that Bri- Brian Regan thing about the guy-
Speaker:who has the social fantasy of he wished he was one of the people who had walked on the moon.
Speaker:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker:So people start reeling out their stories.
Speaker:The one-upper.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Exactly.
Speaker:Always one-ups it, yeah.
Speaker:"I walked on the moon," you know?
Speaker:Um, so the know-it-alls, right?
Speaker:The better-thans.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:That's another kind of
Speaker:They're hard to deal with.
Speaker:Here's another one, gossips.
Speaker:Oh.
Speaker:They're often really passive aggressive, so you go, "Oh, you know," but the, but they may even be quiet when you're, when they're in a crowd.
Speaker:But then they have nothing good to say when they're, you know, talking about people behind their back.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:And they can breed distrust and hurt in a community.
Speaker:Yep.
Speaker:They really do.
Speaker:It's just, they're kind of silent when they're there, but then they're not, and it's-
Speaker:Yeah
Speaker:... yeah, they're tough stuff.
Speaker:Um, and then what I like to call the fourth kind of person that's kinda difficult to deal with, I call them grenades.
Speaker:All
Speaker:right.
Speaker:They're known for being explosive.
Speaker:They're a problem.
Speaker:Uh, they're just plain bossy.
Speaker:They always wanna have their way, and they'll sort of maneuver everything and everybody to try to get it.
Speaker:Oh, okay.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Now, in a minute, I'll talk about what motivates each of those four different people types, those difficult people types.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Like, what motivates them to act the way they do?
Speaker:What's going on be- in their hearts, right?
Speaker:So.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So do you think that Jesus, you know, He got to handpick his disciples and kinda had control over His schedule and that.
Speaker:Do you think Jesus actually had difficult people in His own life, or do you think that He didn't even think in terms like that because He, He viewed everybody as family?
Speaker:Yeah, like if you created everybody, they're all your kids.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Can't leave.
Speaker:Um, He, yeah.
Speaker:I think He clearly did.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:I mean, just, if you just look at even the ones He picked.
Speaker:Now, remember, His dad gave Him the list.
Speaker:Jesus went away and prayed- Sure ... and said, "Hey, there's a whole lot of people hanging out.
Speaker:Who should I, who should I pour into," right?
Speaker:Right.
Speaker:And His father gave Him the 12, and, but you look at that list of who those are, they had to be the biggest bunch of hairballs to hang out with.
Speaker:You got a tax collector, so a, a Jewish guy who has sided with Rome, who's ripping everybody off, hanging out with a working class fisherman.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:And if you've ever worked with, like, longshoremen or dock workers or even- Oh, they're rough.
Speaker:Yeah ... they're rough, right?
Speaker:And then you got these brothers whose mommy is going to Jesus and asking Him f- you know, for, like, a favor for the... I mean, I'm thinking He had- Could be divorced.
Speaker:... there was plenty of EGRs.
Speaker:They might have, it might have been purposely a whole list of difficult people, you know- Yeah ... just to show you, like, "Hey, watch what I'm gonna do," right?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Um, you think about Luke chapter 6, Jesus is taking a little Sabbath stroll with His disciples, and the Pharisees pop up out of the bushes, you know, and they accuse Him of breaking the Sabbath by picking grain.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:And Jesus doesn't get flustered.
Speaker:You know, He, He's not scared.
Speaker:He, He's, He's, He ha- He handles it, right?
Speaker:Be- because He is not really that worried about what other people think.
Speaker:That's not His focus.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:His dad is, right?
Speaker:So that was another example in Scripture.
Speaker:Um, there's the time when Jesus, uh, sort of ticks off all His old neighbors and friends from His hometown of Nazareth, and so they kinda, when they work it out, they're gonna try to throw Him off the cliff.
Speaker:Remember that?
Speaker:That's
Speaker:right.
Speaker:Like, I've never, you know, I've had some things in community go rough, bro, but no one's ever, like, thrown me off the garage, you know?
Speaker:So, but, um, so Jesus had that going on, right?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:And He sees there's no reasoning with those people, so He just walks away.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:He ignores it.
Speaker:He just...
Speaker:It's weird.
Speaker:He doesn't sit there and say, "Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
Speaker:I'm the Son of Man, Son of God.
Speaker:Let's talk about this.
Speaker:Clearly you're in the wrong."
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:He just, He just, He just peace's, He just peace out.
Speaker:He- The Irish goodbyes it, yeah.
Speaker:Yeah, like you, man.
Speaker:He's just- ... He's gone.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:Um, Matthew 15, we, we read about the, the Canaanite woman who, you know, sort of demands that Jesus heals her daughter.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Um, and Jesus says no.
Speaker:But, uh, you know, but then he's c- then he's moved by her, her response of faith, and he goes ahead and he heals her daughter.
Speaker:So we can see that Jesus kinda has an open mind- Mm-hmm ... even with people that might, at first, like, he's like, "I don't have time for this," right?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So when a difficult pe- difficult people kinda show up in our world, we may think, "Oh, great.
Speaker:Here we go again," or, "Oh, I know how that, this is always goes the same." But- Sure ... try to keep an open mind.
Speaker:That's, that's a little thing there.
Speaker:But, but I guess, yeah, to go back to your question, I think Jesus had plenty of people in, uh, his sphere.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Not just in the 12, but obviously people he was running to in the crowds, and teachers of the law, and all that stuff.
Speaker:Clearly.
Speaker:So one of the things, I love that you just unpacked the four... I mean, you gave four examples of, of types of people that come across different ways.
Speaker:And we often, on this show, talk about the thing behind the thing with issues because, you know, whatever we see on the surface, something deeper is going on, right?
Speaker:So maybe we could take a chance at jumping through each one of these four different groups- Mm ... and looking at what's going on, not only with them, but what also is going on in our own hearts when we find ourself getting just completely annoyed with these folks.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Good.
Speaker:Let's, let's start with those, that list of four.
Speaker:Yep.
Speaker:And what's going on, what's the thing behind the thing in their hearts, and then we'll, then we'll do a little surgery on our own heart with that.
Speaker:Deal.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:So the downers, the bummers.
Speaker:Here's what I think's what's going on with people that are just kinda always a bummer.
Speaker:Mm. Mm-hmm.
Speaker:They're
Speaker:not believing that God is actually good, like He always does and only does what is good, and right, and perfect.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:And they believe that He's not really running the world very well, and they secretly believe they could do a better job for themselves- Wow ... and probably for you.
Speaker:Gosh.
Speaker:That's what's going on for people that are just always bummed, 'cause think about it, especially if you're saying, "Hey, this is a Christian," and they're just always bummed.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:There's just no joy there.
Speaker:Well, God must just be doing a s- suck job.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Just sucking it up.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:You know?
Speaker:Never thought about that.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Uh, for the know-it-alls or the better-thans, they're not believing that God's grace is huge and it covers them.
Speaker:Mm.
Speaker:So when you don't believe in grace, like when you really haven't accepted God's unmerited favor, then you're constantly trying to prove yourself to others.
Speaker:You're trying to prove yourself to p- other people.
Speaker:You're trying to prove yourself to yourself.
Speaker:Watch how I... Look at me.
Speaker:I came off feeling pretty good there.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Um, and in really, in baseline, what's really bel- beneath that even, is in some way they're even trying to prove themselves worthy of God's love.
Speaker:Like, "Look what I've done. Look what I've finished." Mm. "See, I did that. They didn't do that." That's why you're always one-upping people.
Speaker:Hey, God's keeping score.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:But y- God, score?
Speaker:God's own Son came-
Speaker:Yeah
Speaker:... and gave His life that we might be forgiven and eternally restored.
Speaker:I mean,
Speaker:wow.
Speaker:And Jesus re- redefined the scoreboard.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So but if you don't believe in grace, then you're gonna always try to be one-upping everybody.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Um, the gossips, again, they don't believe that God is gracious, and He's the glorious one.
Speaker:He's the original.
Speaker:He's the most glorious, and that He loves them exactly as they are.
Speaker:So they think they have to tear others down, and then in that way, it makes room for them to be loved- Mm-hmm
Speaker:by God or maybe by you.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So it's kind of a combination there of not really experiencing truly God's grace, and that God's not the most glorious one like you are.
Speaker:It's like, "If I tear them down, I'll look a little better to you 'cause you're glorious to me right
Speaker:now." Yeah.
Speaker:" I need your approval," you know?
Speaker:Makes sense.
Speaker:And then the grenades, uh, you know, those people that are kinda known for blowing up and trying to get their way and everything, they're, they're just not believing that God is great, and so therefore, they don't have to be in control of everyone.
Speaker:Mm. They're trying to be sovereign, and the reason they're exploding and getting angry all the time and flipping out is because they can't control everybody and every outcome and every political opinion.
Speaker:And so that's what's going on.
Speaker:Their sovereignty- Yeah ... false sovereignty is being thwarted.
Speaker:Like, "Hey." And so that's why they're grenades.
Speaker:They're always blowing up.
Speaker:They're angry 'cause they don't believe God is great, and so they wanna try to control everything- Wow ... just in case.
Speaker:You know, God probably needs my help here.
Speaker:Otherwise, there's no way Heath would be thinking this about that.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Or we wouldn't be eating dinner this late.
Speaker:We would've eaten earlier, but, you know, it's like boom.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:You know?
Speaker:Man, that makes so much sense.
Speaker:I've not thought about it in those terms before.
Speaker:Yeah, but that's so important.
Speaker:There's always something deeper going on.
Speaker:That's so important, 'cause you're gonna have these folks.
Speaker:Now, that doesn't necessarily mean they're gonna be your best friend, but, but if we can start by going, "Hey, what's going on in their hearts that- Yeah ... in, you know, connected to the gospel?" Then that's a good place to start.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:How do I deal with them, right?
Speaker:Well, then what would you say to us?
Speaker:Like, what is the thing behind the thing, uh, for us when we're getting upset with loving these difficult people?
Speaker:Well, um, believe it or not, it's kind of a mixture of all of those same things.
Speaker:Huh.
Speaker:Like, like I'm ... When I'm getting upset with a person who is a grenade-
Speaker:Sure
Speaker:like they're trying to control everything, it's 'cause, wait a minute, uh, they're trying to control everything?
Speaker:This ... We're at my house tonight.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:You know what I mean?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Or, "Listen, I made the dinner. This is what we're having. If it's too salty, it's not salty enough." I- you know what I mean?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So that might be going on.
Speaker:Um, but someone s- swings in, and they ha- they try to one-up everybody's story.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:You're like, "Well, I was kinda just listening, and I was being much more politer than that, but, uh, you know, look, look, I got one, too." Right?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So, so, like, ultimately, what's going on there is we're loving ourselves better than them in the moment.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:The, the reason the EGRs, Extra Grace Required people, uh, bug us-
Speaker:Yep
Speaker:... for whatever the four c- you know, one of the categories they're in or whatever the reason is, is 'cause the truth is we, we don't love them that much.
Speaker:We love ourselves- Mm ... more, and so the things that they're doing that we are all guilty of at some point.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:There's not one of these four things that we've not done.
Speaker:Exactly.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:Or
Speaker:do constantly.
Speaker:Right.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Or con- or really often, yeah.
Speaker:Um, th- th- then what's going on is we really don't love them that much.
Speaker:We love ourselves more, and so what we'd like to do is just, I don't wanna have to show them grace.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Like, they got God's grace.
Speaker:That should be enough for them, you know?
Speaker:So I'll ... You know what would be better is just to g- avoid them.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:Or, you know what would be better than, you know, to avoid, you know, I don't wanna be gossiped about, I just wanna hang out with the person.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:That fixes it.
Speaker:Instead of saying, "Hmm, you know, at times I don't believe God's the most glorious one," and so I'll kinda try to prop, you know, sort of stack the deck a little and make myself look a little better or- Yep
Speaker:you know, I'll say something real ... I'm pretty careful about it, though.
Speaker:It won't come off exactly like gossip, but it'll make me look a little better.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:Because ... And I want them to think well of me, you know?
Speaker:Because I wanna serve them.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:You know, it's really 'cause I wanna help them, and it's, it's all, it's kinda BS, you know?
Speaker:So we're kinda guilty of all the same things, but the thing behind those things is we love ourselves and our glory a whole lot more than we love those people and want God to get the glory as He continues to redeem and restore them.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:That's- And guess how He's gonna do that?
Speaker:How does God restore and redeem people in all their weirdness and brokenness?
Speaker:By using other people.
Speaker:Yeah, it's community.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Like, weird, broken people don't just wake up one day, bloop, restored.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Like, that, you know, no need to gossip anymore.
Speaker:My anger problem's fixed.
Speaker:I don't know what happened, I just woke up.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:How does it happen?
Speaker:It happens through people who will love and, and, and help talk about their own belief and help re- res- you know, remind them and restore them to the truth-
Speaker:Yeah
Speaker:and
Speaker:then help them walk in light of that truth.
Speaker:I don't wanna do that sometimes.
Speaker:That's why I love me more.
Speaker:Yeah, that's good.
Speaker:That's what's going on there, man.
Speaker:All right.
Speaker:So you've given us a lot of, um, understanding, painted some great pictures about why people can be so difficult, and even what's going on in their hearts and our hearts, which I'm super grateful for.
Speaker:As we're finishing up today, maybe you could give us a few f- like, practical real world things that would help us remember, uh, as we go forward in dealing with difficult people.
Speaker:Well, I think baseline is, and I know everybody's listening to this right now, and they're thinking about certain people.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:There's certain people in their mind.
Speaker:You and I both have 'em.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:You know, it's just real.
Speaker:Um, don't try and change them.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Try and understand people.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:There again, that goes right back to what we started with, trying to give you what's the thing behind the thing.
Speaker:Um, if you sit in a position of like, uh, yeah, I wanna, I wanna change this person.
Speaker:I gotta fix that-
Speaker:Right
Speaker:... um, then you kind of have pitted yourself over and against their will.
Speaker:Think about that.
Speaker:Wow.
Speaker:And over and against their brokenness or their fear or their unbelief.
Speaker:And, you know, I'm just reminded, Paul tells us that our, our, our battle is not against flesh and blood.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:You're right, man.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:So don't try to change people.
Speaker:Try to understand them, and if possible, when appropriate, in the right settings, try to help them see the truth behind whatever it is that they're flipping out on and, and, and move from unbelief to belief, or some lie they're believing about another person in community or about you, and that's what's, you know, causing them to do that.
Speaker:Try to, try to understand them, and then try to help them move to belief.
Speaker:And let the Spirit of God work in that
Speaker:That's good
Speaker:But I have to say this, too, there is a caveat.
Speaker:If things don't start to get better or a person just won't receive that ever, and you've, like, taken them aside, you've been gentle with them, you've not just tried to, you know, blow their doors off sitting there, you know, in f- in front of a whole bunch of people, if, if that person is toxic or they're physically dangerous even, then you're gonna need to help them n- n- not participate in certain things or activities with the Family.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:You know, capital F Family.
Speaker:Um, at least until things change.
Speaker:And I can tell you, we've had people that are just, they were just toxic and weird and argumentative, and after loving on them hard and treating them like family and talking to them about it, we had to invite them to not participate, say, in family dinner night anymore.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:" Hey brother, I'm just gonna invite you to not come back until this and this changes."
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:" Now, I still wanna hang out with you.
Speaker:Let's... I wanna keep going to the gym," or, "Let's, like, you know, we still got Cigar and Theology.
Speaker:But this environment, I don't know, man.
Speaker:It's flipping your, you know, switches, and you're not, it's not getting better."
Speaker:It's not working.
Speaker:I've also been in situations where had, uh, I, I remember one, one in particular, there was a, a pretty broken young man in the community, and whenever I was arou- not around, like I'd be out of town or I wouldn't be at a, you know, family dinner night or something, we were out serving or just, you know, game night or whatever we're doing, this person would always pick a fight with another guy.
Speaker:Like, like, he was trying to be the alpha male or something.
Speaker:Huh.
Speaker:They, and they would, they would al- I mean, I'd get a text every time, "Hep, so and so, boom, I don't know why, he went up and pushed so and so in the chest out of the blue, but it was 'cause he was talking to this girl," and you know.
Speaker:Right.
Speaker:And so we eventually had to say, "Hey brother, um, y- you know what?
Speaker:You, you don't get to come to family dinner night anymore."
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:" Not until this and this changes." And couple things happened.
Speaker:He got really upset.
Speaker:I'm just gonna say it.
Speaker:He, he wasn't like- Yeah ... "Oh, I'm really sorry." That's so him.
Speaker:He got really upset and kinda just, like, ghosted us for a couple months.
Speaker:But then little by little, you know, he kinda started coming by the house.
Speaker:'Cause we never said, "Hey, you're, you're, you're out of the family."
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:It's, it's, you know, think about parenting, right, and with kids.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:If the k- you know, if your, if your one s- one child, your son, is, like, clobbering his little sister with a car in the head, after enough times of talking about it, you just take the car away.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:You know?
Speaker:Yeah, why not take the car.
Speaker:It's not like I hate you or you're not my son or she's not your sister, but the car, g- gone.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:You lost that privilege.
Speaker:And so we had to do that, but then eventually, you know, through hanging out and still being like family, he sort of started kinda, and worked his way back into community with folks.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:But then he kinda started flipping out again, and eventually just he moved away.
Speaker:Oh, wow, yeah.
Speaker:You
Speaker:know?
Speaker:But that's, so that's that, that's just the reality of that part of that story.
Speaker:But what did happen in the community with everybody else is they were grateful because they felt protected.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:So instead of this sometimes violent person just popping off all the time, especially when, like, I wasn't around, and I don't know why that was, maybe just 'cause he respected me or something.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:But, um, e- everybody, you know, especially the, the sisters in the community, they were feeling a little freaked out by it.
Speaker:He was always kinda hitting on them.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:He was a little weird, you know, and- Sure ... they felt so protected.
Speaker:And they were, they were glad that it wasn't like, you know, "You, ah, you blew that guy's doors off, man.
Speaker:You reduced him to ashes." Like, nope, loved the guy.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:He gets to choose now what he does with that.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:But they felt super protected.
Speaker:You just, you just didn't let it go on.
Speaker:So you gotta remember, you know, don't try to change people, try to understand them.
Speaker:But if they are toxic or dangerous or harmful with their words and actions and they're not listening, then you, you know
Speaker:And even if they're a believer, then, you know, what does it say in Matthew?
Speaker:Like, treat them like an unbeliever.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:What's that mean?
Speaker:Treat them like, like a broken, damaged brother or sister needs a lot of love.
Speaker:But you don't just let people keep hurting others.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:You get, you have to move them off of that, so.
Speaker:I love that, man.
Speaker:You've given us so much already.
Speaker:I'm gonna ask you for three more things.
Speaker:Well, I'm gonna summarize, but yeah.
Speaker:The big three.
Speaker:The big three.
Speaker:You get those for free, the free download, which is just the three takeaways we want you to leave with even right now.
Speaker:You get it by going to everydaydisciple.com/bigthree.
Speaker:Caesar, what would you say the big three are for this week?
Speaker:Number one, remember, it's not your job to try and label and then fix everyone that you experience as difficult.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:' Cause the people that you experience as difficult, they, everybody else might go like, "No, I don't see any issues." So it could just be a, a you thing, right?
Speaker:You know.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Who knows?
Speaker:You may be the difficult person on someone else's list.
Speaker:Um, God is great, and you don't have to be in control.
Speaker:Seek to understand them, what they're going through, why they are the way they are, why they respond a certain way in a certain situation, and then look for ways that you can serve this person-
Speaker:Okay
Speaker:right then in the moment or later on, so that you can show them the value that you're placing on them, and, and ultimately you're mirroring how God sees them.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Because God sees us in our broken state and loves us-
Speaker:Mm. Beautiful
Speaker:... completely.
Speaker:And He served us when we were yet sinners to the point of death.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So, you know, you know, you wanna turn something around with people, don't label them, try to fix them.
Speaker:Serve them.
Speaker:Mm.
Speaker:And, and watch, watch what happens to their hearts.
Speaker:That's beautiful.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Second of the big three, um, difficult people present their need for the gospel really clearly.
Speaker:You know what I mean?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Like, in other words, if they're consistently kinda popping off in the same way and kinda getting on your last nerve and everybody else the same way, they've made it pretty obvious what their gospel need is.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:And that's what ... We're all in this for discipleship, which is the process of helping people move from- That's what we do
Speaker:unbelief to belief, right?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So, so I say don't, don't, you know, feel like, "Oh, man, there's that gal again, and she's all," you know.
Speaker:It's like- Sure ... "Hey, thanks for making your gospel need really clear." So when you listen and ask good questions and seek to understand the thing behind the thing- Yeah ... that we were talking about, guess what?
Speaker:It's always a gospel issue that leads to, you know, any of us being either difficult or argumentative or- Sure ... broken or whatever.
Speaker:It's always a gospel issue, something we're not believing about God and about ourselves.
Speaker:So what are they believing and not believing about you or this community or themselves or God right now?
Speaker:Yep.
Speaker:And how could you help them to see and understand the truth?
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:Love that, man.
Speaker:That's your goal.
Speaker:It's so simple if you're actually paying attention, right?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Number three, seek to have your own heart in a place of love before attempting to deal with a difficult person.
Speaker:So, you know, if, if ... People can just tick us off, and you
Speaker:or really be hurtful.
Speaker:Before you address it or before you try to, you know, help or protect or whatever, um, check your own heart.
Speaker:Try to get in a place of love before addressing it.
Speaker:What's your motive for wanting to address this person-
Speaker:Hmm
Speaker:... and, and how you're experiencing them?
Speaker:Is it focused on their good and God's glory, or primarily on yourself and how you wanna run things- Hmm
Speaker:or how you want the night to go or the event to go or the evening to go or whatever.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:Often, when we take the time necessary to gently address a person in a way that they can hear from us and receive something, uh, and it's helpful, a bond of trust is built that can change how they act and how they respond to us and how we then respond to them.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So, you know, check your own heart before going in there.
Speaker:Good words, man.
Speaker:Really good.
Speaker:Thank you for that.
Speaker:Yeah, man.
Speaker:All right.
Speaker:You get those big three, again, by going to everydaydisciple.com/bigthree.
Speaker:Uh, we'll get those right away to you.
Speaker:And if you haven't joined us on our Facebook group, go head to the search bar.
Speaker:Type in Everyday Disciple Podcast.
Speaker:You know what I'm loving about the Facebook group?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:We're getting a lot of good show ideas.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:People are just bringing up great stuff-
Speaker:Yep
Speaker:... and getting to kinda help us pre-flush out what's going on, what are the handles, you know, over time.
Speaker:Yeah, kinda
Speaker:reading the temperature of where people
Speaker:are wanting to go.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:I'm loving it.
Speaker:So I'd love to have more people in there with us.
Speaker:Thanks for joining us today.
Speaker:For more information on this show and to get loads of free discipleship resources, visit everydaydisciple.com.
Speaker:And remember, you really can live with the spiritual freedom and relational peace that Jesus promised every day.