Baptism and Your True Identity
Most of us think of baptism as a one-time event — something that happened to us, not something we actually live from. But there’s another baptism happening constantly, one almost none of us notice. The culture around us is forming our identity every single day — shaping what we believe about our worth, our value, and what we’re for.
In this episode of the Everyday Disciple Podcast, we’re going to talk with author and pastor Eric Peterson about the staggering power of Christian baptism — what it was really declaring over your life, and how living from that identity changes everything about how you show up every single day.
In This Episode You’ll Learn:
- How culture is constantly “baptizing” us into a DO=BE identity – exhausting us
- Why Christian baptism is a declaration about who you already are
- How the Church has lost the full power and significance of what baptism is about
- A simple daily practice to help you live from your trinitarian identity
From this episode:
“Pay attention to how often water is present and its importance in your daily life. Let it remind you, like the sacrament of your baptism, that you are now immersed into your true and restored trinitarian identity. You can now live as a full-fledged member of God’s family of missionary servants, sent as a disciple of Jesus into your world to make more disciples… filling the world with God’s glory.”
Each week the Big 3 will give you immediate action steps to get you started.
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Links and Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Coaching and Mentorship in Missional Living by Caesar and his wife Tina
Resources for missional living and group training – Missio Publishing
The Gospel In Everyday Life Workshop Register Now FREE
Transcript
We talk a lot about this great command, this great commission to go and make disciples all over the world, teaching them everything I've taught you, and then baptizing, baptismos, s- soaking, immersing them into the name of the Father and the name of the Son and the name of the Holy Spirit, that all of that is not only the church's commissioning, like, that's what we're up to, that's the mission, but it's all a giant identity statement.
Speaker:'Cause whenever you hear "in the name of," that's an identity statement.
Speaker:You know, my last name's Kalinowski.
Speaker:My son is also Caesar Kalinowski.
Speaker:His son is Caesar Kalinowski.
Speaker:He's the fifth one.
Speaker:"In the name of" is a big identity statement.
Speaker:Are we on the right path here with this stuff?
Speaker:No, you're precisely right.
Speaker:It's an identity into the holy name, the threefold name.
Speaker:Because if you don't have your identity accurate, it's really impossible to live a meaningful, purposeful life.
Speaker:The identity is, is central.
Speaker:It's prerequisite.
Speaker:Welcome to the Everyday Disciple Podcast, where you'll learn how to live with greater intentionality and an integrated faith that naturally fits into every area of life.
Speaker:In other words, discipleship as a lifestyle.
Speaker:This is the stuff your parents, pastors, and seminary professors probably forgot to tell you.
Speaker:And now, here's your host, Caesar Kalinowski.
Speaker:Back together, my friend.
Speaker:Another episode of the glorious podcast.
Speaker:And is there a more beautiful day of the year here in the Northwest we
Speaker:can have?
Speaker:Oh, I know.
Speaker:I wish... I'm... You know, where I'm sitting, I can see outside, and it's, it's all... it's nearly temperatureless, which I don't know if I've mentioned this before, but that's, like, what I strive for in life.
Speaker:I think heaven's gonna be temperatureless, where- Not
Speaker:too
Speaker:hot, not too cold ... I don't perceive any heat or cold right now.
Speaker:It's just perfect.
Speaker:Well, I walked in, and you were on the back porch with your cup of coffee and just looking at the birds
Speaker:and- Oh.
Speaker:Oh, my goodness.
Speaker:You just got back from a little vacation, but- Yeah
Speaker:I think you might vacation a little differently than I.
Speaker:Yeah, we did... We took the four kids camping, like straight up tent camping in the woods, uh-
Speaker:Not glamping.
Speaker:Not glamping by any means.
Speaker:Uh-
Speaker:Lots of bug bites?
Speaker:Yep, couple bee stings.
Speaker:Skin knees.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Skin knees.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:Uh, grit that took about 20 minutes underneath our fingernails to get- How many
Speaker:nights?
Speaker:So we just did two this time, and we're doing another three next month and another part of the, another part of
Speaker:the state.
Speaker:So it takes, like, two days to load the car-
Speaker:Yeah
Speaker:... for all the stuff you need.
Speaker:Day and a half to empty it.
Speaker:Two, two days of camping, so that's a week's vacation.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Perfect.
Speaker:Seriously, it takes...
Speaker:And the kids... But, you know, the kids loved it, and they're out at the beach, and we're flinging them in the water.
Speaker:You know what?
Speaker:We loved it, too, when the kids were younger.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:It re- it really did.
Speaker:It just got, get to a point now that if it's... Yeah, if there's not a remote control and I can-
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:I know
Speaker:Get some sort of a beverage cold in my hand Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker:It's-
Speaker:There's a, there's kind of this ongoing battle when we camp because Kathleen's family grew up with these things called Holy Rollies, which is a-
Speaker:Holy Rollies.
Speaker:Yeah, they're spiritual, but it's a- They take a, a raw biscuit on the end of a dal, toast it, roll it in butter, sprinkle it with cinnamon and sugar, and add chocolate and butter on the inside.
Speaker:Oh, health foods.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah, it's great for you.
Speaker:It's like an alternative to s'mores.
Speaker:Oh.
Speaker:And she, her family loves it, and I think they're just maybe a C minus at best.
Speaker:They're not as good as a s'more.
Speaker:No.
Speaker:Well, I don't like s'mores.
Speaker:So our family did what these... They're called dough boys, and it's the same exact thing-
Speaker:except the inside is full of cold pudding and whipped cream.
Speaker:And so it's like- You
Speaker:have to inject it in after it's been-
Speaker:Yeah, pretty much ... roasted?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Okay, I was gonna say, how does it get in there and stay cold?
Speaker:So it's the eternal fight of us trying to
Speaker:convince friends.
Speaker:All right, enough of that.
Speaker:Like, I'm sure everybody tuned in to hear our camping stories-
Speaker:'cause right now my head is full of a bunch of, like, camping horror stories with the kids.
Speaker:Oh, yeah.
Speaker:I won't go there.
Speaker:Hey, man, before we get started, I wanted to get to a review that we got from- Great ... Rev Rich White, who says, "I'm just, I'm just beginning my ministry as a Church of England vicar, and this podcast has helped to radically reshape my vision for family and mission."
Speaker:Nice.
Speaker:" It's so thought-provoking and yet re- really practical.
Speaker:Every vicar needs to listen to this."
Speaker:Nice.
Speaker:That might be our new slogan.
Speaker:That- Every vicar needs to listen to this ... it's
Speaker:a new tagline.
Speaker:Now, for those of you who are, are listening from North America, and you don't know, like, exactly what a vicar is, it's kinda like pastor.
Speaker:Right.
Speaker:It's pretty similar.
Speaker:I have a friend, a good friend, who's a vicar, uh, in, in England, in Cambridge, and, um, the ho- her house is called The Vicarage.
Speaker:Huh.
Speaker:It's not a parsonage.
Speaker:It's a vicarage.
Speaker:Wow.
Speaker:Anyway.
Speaker:I didn't know that.
Speaker:All right, so pretty excited about today's guest, hey?
Speaker:Yeah, so we've got Eric Peterson on, who...
Speaker:Eric is actually... I came to know Eric through a guest we've had on the show, David McDonald, and then we have a mutual friend, Len Sweet, who we'll have on the show coming up.
Speaker:Great.
Speaker:Um, but Eric is one of my favorite guys.
Speaker:Now, he's from Maryland originally.
Speaker:Now he lives in the Northwest in Spokane, where he's a pastor- Transplant
Speaker:and has been for years.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:He's, he's got his wife, Elizabeth.
Speaker:They've got three kids.
Speaker:Uh, and what I really love is this book he released called Wade in the Water.
Speaker:He, um, he really has focused the last couple years on the purpose of baptism and identity in the life of a believer.
Speaker:So big.
Speaker:Yeah, now-
Speaker:We, we talk about this a lot on the podcast, but-
Speaker:Yeah, it's gonna be right up our alley
Speaker:now we
Speaker:get an expert.
Speaker:Yeah, you know, and Eric's dad, Eugene, was a huge influence in my life.
Speaker:I've, I mean, The Message Bible's the one I read most time, and the apple has not fallen far from the tree.
Speaker:He's just a really pastoral guy.
Speaker:I think he's gonna be a great guest on the show today.
Speaker:I am excited to get into this with Eric.
Speaker:All right, Eric, thanks for being with us today.
Speaker:You're welcome.
Speaker:Good to be with you.
Speaker:I have really enjoyed over the last, I think about year now, getting to know you a little bit here and there, either through Facebook or actually the times that we've spent together.
Speaker:And I mean, we've hung out twice, and once was in England, and once was in Oregon.
Speaker:Uh, and, and one thing that I really appreciate about you is when I, when I was first introduced to you w- was the conversation about how important baptism was for you.
Speaker:And I know that in our, in our own personal conversations, you have a real deep desire to help people not only see themselves as holy, but to live, like, sacred, meaningful, abundant lives in the midst of this broken and fearful world.
Speaker:Uh, that's not only a theme from your doctoral work but part of your new book, uh, W- Wade in the Water as well.
Speaker:So I'm just kinda curious, where did this passion come from in your life, and how, how... What made it become such a significant passion for you?
Speaker:Well, I think, like a lot of things, it started small, um, and grew and evolved and developed.
Speaker:I thought it was gonna be a short-lived kind of emphasis in my pastoral work, but, um, I'm, I'm 22 years into this experiment, and I've haven't found the bottom of this well yet.
Speaker:I think it started as a grace, really.
Speaker:Um, I came to the Spokane area to start a new church in 1997, and I was, um... It's not something I wanted to do.
Speaker:I was called to do it, and I came with some, uh, considerable resistance and reluctance, and I had a lot of fear of failure.
Speaker:And, um, and so early on, I became aware of a danger, um, that I would treat or think of people as resources to establish, um, and develop a successful church.
Speaker:So I s- I, I think I was just aware that I had this tendency, or there was a temptation to view people through what they could, um, provide, do, um, you know, as, as resources, people that could write checks, that kind of thing, and, uh, that just felt so wrong.
Speaker:So I, I realized that these are children of God.
Speaker:These are holy souls.
Speaker:Uh, again, it was just... I, I think I just sort of stumbled on it, actually, realizing if I can relate to people as the baptized, uh, that's gonna help protect me from reifying them into these objective resources, and it did.
Speaker:It, it really helped me to treat them as they should be treated.
Speaker:But then as things developed, I realized this is also a gift to them, um, to all of us, to think of ourselves as the baptized, and it just kind of developed from there.
Speaker:And then when I was able to take some time to do this concentrated doctoral study, I, I spent, you know, two or three years researching it more carefully, and, uh, and that became a gift, just to unpack and develop something that had been for a good number of years, um, I was just sort of operating On the fly, sort of on the, you know, backseat of my pants, so to speak
Speaker:Has this been something then that's become in, in the, in the many years since you started the church and now many years of pastoring this same body, uh, is, is this a recurring theme then in your preaching and your equipping of the people, uh, for the works of service and discipleship and all?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker:I mean, it's, um, I try not to overdo it, but there are at least three references to baptism in every worship service.
Speaker:Um, usually they're just the Trinitarian formula, but that's the baptismal formula.
Speaker:It's, it's frequent, uh, not every Sunday, but frequently, um, water is being poured into the font.
Speaker:We are rehearsing our baptismal vows.
Speaker:Um, I'll remind people of that kind of identity language.
Speaker:I mean, I think 80% of our congregation, if you were to say, "What's the... What is this church about?" Um, I'm pretty sure 80% would say baptism.
Speaker:And it's been meaningful for them.
Speaker:They're not just indulging me.
Speaker:So for example, it was just the other night, I, uh, saw on the prayer chain a note came across that said, "Thank you for praying for my Aunt Hazel.
Speaker:She completed her baptism this evening."
Speaker:What do you, what did they mean by that?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Well, it's, um, they've just learned to understand that baptism is, it's a covenantal relationship, and the covenants that we make have a beginning.
Speaker:Um, there's a d- there's an event that establishes the covenant, but it gets lived out and practiced over a lifetime.
Speaker:And so much like a marriage, where you're, there's a wedding day, there's an event, um, but that's just the beginning.
Speaker:That's just a moment in time.
Speaker:The, the, a couple that gets married spends the rest of their life practicing their vows.
Speaker:And, you know, no one expects them to come back from their honeymoon having marriage all figured out.
Speaker:You get a whole lifetime to work out those, those promises and vows and to honor the marriage, and it's not finished until somebody dies.
Speaker:So I think there's a grace in that.
Speaker:You know, you, um, it's not perfection that we're, that is being asked of us.
Speaker:Faulty faith is just fine.
Speaker:We're all rookies in the life of faith, and we stumble and fall, and, and that's the grace.
Speaker:We, um, we just return.
Speaker:That's the, that's the notion of repentance.
Speaker:We just keep turning back to the lover of our souls and Keep moving.
Speaker:Take the next step of faith
Speaker:Eric, how do you find that as that, that reality of that, that baptism, that covenant and that immersion into identity, how, how do you see it play out in people's lives as Christians?
Speaker:How do, like, I don't, you know, I wanna be careful how I say this, but like, how do they become different Christians when they start to, this starts to really sink in for them?
Speaker:What's the change?
Speaker:What's the, what, like, over the years, what have you said, like, "This is the biggest thing that starts to shift"?
Speaker:It varies from person to person, but as part of my research, I did interview a good chunk of the congregation, uh, 'cause I was curious about that question.
Speaker:How has this emphasis on baptismal identity, uh, helped develop you in the, in the life of Christ?
Speaker:Uh, and so it's varied quite a bit, but I think it has primarily a reorienting effect.
Speaker:Uh, the way I think about it is that we are, I heard your word immersed, and I like that very much.
Speaker:We're, we're immersed in a culture, uh, where there's this massive propaganda machine.
Speaker:It's a campaign that's at work, and we're so deep in it that we don't even notice it much of the time, but the messages are telling us who we are, uh, and they're mostly lies.
Speaker:So the primary, you know, marketing campaign in which we live is saying, "Well, you're a consumer and you're a producer." So meaningful lives are accompanied by what you buy and, and consume.
Speaker:It's, it's what you can consume, what you can produce, and what you can acquire.
Speaker:Those are the kind of the three... That's the godhead of cultural baptism.
Speaker:And so the sacramental approach is to say, "No, that's, that's a, th- those are lies.
Speaker:Uh, your identity is located in this reality that you have been adopted as a child of God, that you've been grafted into the body of Christ.
Speaker:There's nothing in heaven or on earth or in hell that can separate you from the love of God, and it doesn't depend on what you do, uh, or how you behave, but simply the fact that God has said yes to you." Uh, well, that, that provides a lot of space and freedom to be human and imperfect and, um, flawed, and I think what I've noticed is, is the amount of shame that most of us carry with us, and so the sacramental approach has a way of...
Speaker:I'm not quite sure what the right word is, but I think it has a way of, uh, diffusing that, uh, because shame is accompanied by, uh, identifiers.
Speaker:That is, it, it identifies us i- in a negative way.
Speaker:There's something terribly innately wrong with me.
Speaker:But when in baptism I hear God say, "Mine it, um, it speaks a word of truth into this sea of lies And there's great implication from that.
Speaker:You know, one...
Speaker:You even refer to Lady Gaga as, as a priestess in the religion of pop culture.
Speaker:Maybe you can speak into this a bit and, and how the sort of sacred secular debate comes into play regarding this specific topic.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:I mean, Lady Gaga is a... I'm a fan of hers.
Speaker:I think she's brilliant and creative, but she uses some of these images of baptism.
Speaker:There's water, uh, in her videos.
Speaker:Sometimes it's that explicit.
Speaker:It's that, you know, obvious and unvarnished.
Speaker:Uh, most of the times it's much more subtle, and that's where it's more dangerous, I think.
Speaker:That's where we, I think, as pastors are trying to raise a level of awareness.
Speaker:Like, this is what's going on.
Speaker:This is a world that God loves, but it is, uh, it's inhabited by these lies, uh, that are, that are spouting values that are contrary to the Kingdom of God.
Speaker:There's also that story I think I, I put in the book about Sarah Palin when she was the keynote speaker at an NRA convention.
Speaker:And, um, and, and she said, "If..."
Speaker:This is a, this is a rough paraphrase, but it's essentially, "If I were in the Oval Office, if I were in this position, uh, we would show them, uh, that waterboarding is how we baptize terrorists." Whoa.
Speaker:Ouch.
Speaker:I don't know if I've ever been more offended, you know, when I came across that.
Speaker:Um, but most of the time it's much more subtle.
Speaker:It's, it's gonna be, um, eat this, drive this, wear this, and you're gonna be a happy, fulfilled person.
Speaker:Those are the lies.
Speaker:And if we're not returning constantly back to our, our identity in Jesus, it's gonna be a whole lot easier to swallow some of those lies without even, without even gagging, right?
Speaker:Oh, and it's prevalent.
Speaker:It's everywhere.
Speaker:It's ubiquitous, yeah.
Speaker:So you, you've talked about the importance of Jesus being baptized.
Speaker:You've talked and written about it.
Speaker:Uh, the, probably Jesus being the one person who didn't necessarily need to be baptized or repent necessarily, change his mind of anything, and the significance of that event, his baptism.
Speaker:Uh, can you talk to us a little bit about that?
Speaker:'Cause I know there's always, uh, in my life, in pastoring even, there's, there's a lot of different sides to that, and I find it very fascinating as well as to, like, okay, why did Jesus come to John to be baptized, and why is that so significant for us?
Speaker:It's a good question, and I don't think I've got a complete answer for it.
Speaker:I'm still working on this.
Speaker:I think there's, uh, there's some mystery there in my mind, and all of the scholarly responses I have found not to be altogether satisfying.
Speaker:So John resisted that too, right?
Speaker:He was with us.
Speaker:He's like, "What are you talking about?
Speaker:You should be baptizing me." But Jesus' response is, "This is a fulfillment of righteousness.
Speaker:There's something right about this." Um, so I think part of it is this helps us to, um, dispel of any possibility or any, any creeping notion that Jesus was not fully human.
Speaker:Uh, this is one of the ways that He demonstrates His full humanity.
Speaker:Uh, He comes that close to us, comes alongside us in that, uh, intimate a way as to say, "I'm all in with the rest of humanity, uh, including all the, the mortality that goes with that."
Speaker:Um, and then the last piece that I, I think makes sense to me is that at Jesus' baptism, we get the voice of God, um, and the presence of the Holy Spirit.
Speaker:Uh, "This is my beloved Son with whom I'm well pleased." Uh, so the heavens, you know, are cracked open.
Speaker:This voice of pleasure and affirmation comes thundering down and...
Speaker:Well, I think it's significant that it's relational language.
Speaker:It's not, "Here's Jesus of Nazareth," it's, "This is my Son." So it's altogether relational, personal, and that's part of what happens in our baptism.
Speaker:We bring the fullness of our humanity.
Speaker:Uh, we submit ourselves, uh, to this action that is both lethal and life-giving.
Speaker:There's a drowning and a, and a raising.
Speaker:It's got that twofold purpose.
Speaker:Uh, we're promised the gift of the Holy Spirit to accompany us all the days of our life, and we hear this thundering voice.
Speaker:It's a definitive exclamatory voice.
Speaker:"Mine. My daughter. My son." I can go through a lot of hard things if I know that.
Speaker:Have you ever wondered, Eric, why we don't see any example of Jesus baptizing anyone?
Speaker:I know it's a bit of a tangent, but, you know, it's one of those many things like Jesus, if you just could've given us a little more information or written that down or the order of service.
Speaker:If you just told us how many songs on the front end and the back end, we, we could get a...
Speaker:We could probably half the amount of denominations.
Speaker:But I've always wondered why as Jesus sort of modeled the life and, and, uh, of the kingdom and life in light of being the Son, God's own Son- Mm ... and that, you know, when you pray that you pray, "This is our Father," and wow.
Speaker:So how, how come we don't see Him modeling that where He baptizes someone and, and, and immerses them, baptizes, soaks them into this restored identity?
Speaker:Well, it's a good question.
Speaker:Uh, and my limited understanding is that He didn't do a lot of things.
Speaker:Um, He took, in His three-year ministry, He, He did significant things- But there are a lot of things he didn't do, and it wasn't until after, um, Ascension and Pentecost that the church then continued with that work.
Speaker:But there are a lot of things that the apostles did that Jesus didn't do.
Speaker:It was like this continuation of ministry.
Speaker:So I, I think it's intentional on his part.
Speaker:He just, he takes us to a, to a point, and then the church, um, carries it on from there.
Speaker:But, you know, among his last words are, "This is what I want you to do.
Speaker:I want you to go into the whole world, and I want you to baptize." Um, that's the, that's the, that's the charge, right?
Speaker:That's the Great Commission.
Speaker:Make disciples and then baptize them on both ends, right?
Speaker:Even as you're talking there, Eric, I was thinking about, uh, the time that I was baptized, and, um, and, um, you know, I know a lot of churches that typically, the way you're speaking about baptism, there's a sacredness to it.
Speaker:There's this identity.
Speaker:There's a son ship, a daughter ship, uh, and it's a whole lot more than, like, throwing people through a, a watering trough to get the numbers up for the big, you know, the big Easter event or whatever it might be.
Speaker:Do you think that the church, not only in America but maybe most contemporary forms of the church we see today by and large, have either lost, like, the paramount significance of baptism or maybe ne- have never really saw it for what it should be in the first place?
Speaker:And what effects do you think this actually has on followers of Jesus today?
Speaker:Yeah, that's a big question.
Speaker:And yeah, I think part of my grievance with the church of the 20th, 21st century, uh, which is not really unique to other centuries, is that, uh, we've kind of dissected some of it.
Speaker:We've scrutinized it, and I mean, I just, I find it kind of crazy and silly and scandalous that we have denominations that have been formed around debates about h- how, you know, an understanding of baptism and how it should be administered.
Speaker:That just seems altogether like that's a... Can you miss the point any more than that?
Speaker:Um, when it gets down to how it's administered-
Speaker:Don't be sprinkling anyone.
Speaker:Don't splash when you're in there.
Speaker:I just have no interest at all in the, in the administration.
Speaker:That is the, you know, whether it's sprinkling, immersion, effusion, all the different, you know, technical ways, or whether it's credo or paedo baptism, uh, whether it's children or believing people.
Speaker:'Cause that's, that's where the church has gotten bogged down in debates, and I feel like we've missed the beauty and the, uh, the significance.
Speaker:This is God claiming us as, uh, the sacred souls that we are and ushering us into lives in the Kingdom of God as citizens of heaven.
Speaker:And, I mean, it's just, you know, it's massive, and it's beautiful, and just think that there's got to be a lot of room for- differing understandings of not only how to do it, but what it actually means.
Speaker:Um, but we, we like our precision
Speaker:So Eric, we teach a lot about discipleship and really living a lifestyle of discipleship and mission as it flows from our identity.
Speaker:And, and we've taught it, well, for years, you know, in, you know, with our people, but also now, you know, as, as an author myself and on, on, on the podcast here, we talk a lot about this great command, this great commission to go and make disciples all over the world, teaching them everything I've taught you, and then baptizing, baptismo, s- soaking, immersing them into the name of the Father, and the name of the Son, and the name of the Holy Spirit.
Speaker:That all of that is not only the church's commissioning, like that's what we're up to, that's the mission, but it's all a giant identity statement.
Speaker:'Cause whenever you hear in the name of, that's an identity statement.
Speaker:You know, my last name's Kalinowski.
Speaker:My son is also Caesar Kalinowski.
Speaker:His son is Caesar Kalinowski.
Speaker:He's the fifth one.
Speaker:In the name of is a big identity statement.
Speaker:Are we on the right path here with this stuff?
Speaker:No, you're precisely right.
Speaker:It's an identity into the holy name, the threefold name, because if you don't have your identity accurate, it's really impossible to live a meaningful, purposeful life.
Speaker:The identity is, is central.
Speaker:It's prerequisite.
Speaker:We have to know who we are.
Speaker:And my pastoral concern is that we live in a culture where ID theft is occurring all the time, and, and we've bought these, uh, lies of who we are or who we should be, and so we can't live a good, holy life as a result.
Speaker:So baptism, I think, is, is, is the way to...
Speaker:the most compelling way to kind of invite people into a way of understanding themselves in relationship to God so that, uh, we can live, uh, according to this, uh, sacred ID.
Speaker:Yeah, so often in the church we talk about your identity is now in Christ, but it doesn't take it far enough because it sort of shorthand means, well, you're saved now because of the work of Christ, um, and so your identity's wrapped up in him.
Speaker:He's your life, and someday you get to go to heaven, and, and no one really, like, quite knows what that means.
Speaker:It's nice.
Speaker:It's a good thinking.
Speaker:It's accurate.
Speaker:But what about the rest of the Godhead?
Speaker:So, uh, there's huge... like I said, there's huge implication and, and change that occurs when we see people start to really understand and embrace their Trinitarian identity.
Speaker:That's how you were created, that got broken and messed up in ways we don't fully understand at the fall and, and of course my own choices as well.
Speaker:But now, as a disciple of Jesus, we're being reimmersed, reconnected to the identity, the family of God in community with others.
Speaker:Wow, it's so big.
Speaker:It's so big.
Speaker:Where would you spend like, you know, like the last minute or two here with us encouraging people who've not spent much time considering the importance of baptism?
Speaker:Where would you encourage them to s- you know, to, to go?
Speaker:Like we're, what, what... We're obviously we're gonna be referring, uh, and you know, them to your book and all, but what, what would you think would be beneficial for maybe pastors listening or just the average, you know, Christian listening to this, um, if you were to speak to them pastorally about baptism?
Speaker:I mean, one of the things that was so intriguing to me is, uh, as part of my discipline and research was to kind of go through the scriptures from Genesis to the Revelation, and to just notice the ways that water figured into the narrative.
Speaker:And with just a few exceptions, you can see how the presence or prevalence of water is, um, is connected to the, the deep, uh, layered meaning of baptism.
Speaker:But the first six days of creation-
Speaker:That's cool that we can see that connection, but why do you think... I mean, that's not accidental.
Speaker:No, I don't think it is.
Speaker:I mean, water is a part of the f- uh, five of the six days of creation.
Speaker:It's, it's like th- this is the formative stuff of the origins of life.
Speaker:Um, and as I mentioned earlier, it's got these both lethal and life-giving qualities about it.
Speaker:It's the most prevalent element on the planet.
Speaker:I mean, so I think this is the genius of a sacrament, is that it takes something that's so common, present, um, ordinary, and adds these deep layers of meaning and significance.
Speaker:I mean, that's where I would start, is just to, every time you see the word water or find a, you know, a, a moist kind of word in the scriptures, just think about how it gets connected to baptism.
Speaker:But ultimately it becomes this daily thing where drink a glass of water, I'm baptized.
Speaker:Take a shower, I'm baptized.
Speaker:Um, get caught in the rain, this is, these are the baptismal blessings.
Speaker:And you can't go very long without it, right?
Speaker:Just like the sacrament of, of we, that we call communion, taking, taking, you know, the Lord's Supper.
Speaker:That's the most common three times a day thing going, going down in humans' lives in rhythm other than breath and the fact that we're made of water.
Speaker:So yeah, again, we see a sacrament where we're constantly being reminded of grace and God's overarching purpose to fill the world with His glory.
Speaker:Beautiful.
Speaker:So part of what's happened, I think, is that we have, um, we've elevated these things as sacraments in the church so that they become difficult to access.
Speaker:Um, you know, you spend... Uh, there was a time when we were spending two years in, uh, catechesis, preparation for baptism Uh, we memorize all these things.
Speaker:There's a bishop involved, and only a priest can administer this, and there are these renunciations and exorcisms.
Speaker:And, and now with communion, we, um, you know, similarly, at least in my tribe, it's you have to be an ordained pastor to celebrate the sacrament.
Speaker:So part of what I'm trying to do is bring it back to the, um, this is a part of your daily life.
Speaker:This is not a Sunday ritual, uh, or an occasional kind of thing.
Speaker:And so, um, I've actually tried this a couple of times, where during a, a dinner meal with my family and friends, at some point I'll just reach into the bread basket and say, "On the night in which he was betrayed, the Lord Jesus took bread." And I won't even finish it.
Speaker:I'll just say that much, and that dinner becomes a sacrament.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:It's beautiful, man.
Speaker:Do you do the same thing with water?
Speaker:Well, I, I, yeah.
Speaker:I mean, I, I do in worship.
Speaker:Um, you know, I'll invite people to, uh, rehearse their baptismal vows, which is really just this two-step dance, right?
Speaker:It's just a turning from and a turning toward.
Speaker:I'll pose those questions while I'm pouring the water and give them a chance to just say, uh, yes to that.
Speaker:I do.
Speaker:And I think we need these regular reminders because we are... We're forgetful.
Speaker:We've got amnesia.
Speaker:We keep forgetting who we are.
Speaker:Eric, I just wanna say, uh, as we wrap up our time here, man, I, I, I greatly appreciate our, our few times together, look forward to many more together.
Speaker:Uh, I, I'm thankful that you, uh, you take this call, especially of the water and the baptism.
Speaker:Every time I'm with you, it comes out, and I, I just appreciate how pastoral you are as a person and how, uh, I, I feel deeply cared for by you when we're together.
Speaker:So I appreciate who you are, and I... And, and thanks for sharing with us today.
Speaker:No, you're welcome.
Speaker:Thank you.
Speaker:This has certainly given me a lot to think about, Eric.
Speaker:This has given me a lot of food for thought, and, uh, yeah, can't wait to let the Spirit take my heart deeper into this.
Speaker:It's beautiful.
Speaker:Thank you.
Speaker:So now we need a f- we need a follow-up book on, on communion so we can have the sacrament, like a sacrament series by Eric Peterson.
Speaker:Ooh.
Speaker:There you
Speaker:go.
Speaker:I think, I think that book, that book's been written, I think.
Speaker:Well, thanks for being with us today.
Speaker:You're very welcome.
Speaker:It's been good to be with you.
Speaker:Thanks for your interest in this and for taking it seriously.
Speaker:It was a pleasure to be with you and get to talk with you today, Eric.
Speaker:Thank you so much.
Speaker:You
Speaker:bet.
Speaker:Man, I really appreciate every time, like I said, Cesar, before we even started recording, every time we're... Every time I'm around Eric, I just feel like he's thoughtful and he's wise and he ties in faith to, you know, some of these big thoughts to things that are actually Definitely a
Speaker:pastor's heart, huh?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Wow.
Speaker:I really appreciate that.
Speaker:And one of the things that we'd like to follow up with, even, even on the episodes with our guests, is the big three, which is, if nothing else, we want you to walk away with a free download In a printable PDF form of the top three takeaways that we want you to leave with from this week's episode, right?
Speaker:And you can get them for free by going to everydaydisciple.com/bigthree.
Speaker:Caesar, if you were to sum up what we talked about today, uh, what would, where would you take us- Ooh ... with the big three?
Speaker:Well, don't, don't miss the fact that Eric said he really was a huge fan of Lady Gaga, okay?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Me too.
Speaker:Number one.
Speaker:So I like the, I like them a lot better right then, so Yeah.
Speaker:But also, well, there's some challenges.
Speaker:No.
Speaker:Here's the big three today, okay?
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:And I'm kind of following our pattern like we often do of head, heart, hands with this, but so much could be said.
Speaker:Okay, so here we go.
Speaker:First one, the lie of the dominant culture is that what you produce, consume, and acquire equals your true value.
Speaker:Hmm.
Speaker:Wow.
Speaker:That was huge- Yeah, it was ... when you said that.
Speaker:So this, th- and all of that then puts us under the heavy weight of a do equals be existence.
Speaker:What we do equals our value.
Speaker:Sure.
Speaker:And that crushes the soul, and it breeds fear and separation between us.
Speaker:You're absolutely right.
Speaker:I've never... I o- I've heard the consume piece, but the acquiring piece and the pro- produce, I've dealt with that a bit before, the do to be.
Speaker:But the acquiring aspect, I'd never even contributed- Wow ... that to the three.
Speaker:Wow.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:All right, number two, when we operate out of our, our identity, believing that we are God's beloved children and that our heavenly Dad is really well pleased with us, then we get to live in freedom and deeper connection to others, seeing everyone else as part of the same divine family.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So no longer do we need to prove our worth or importance or strive to earn our Father's affection.
Speaker:We can live fully embracing the truth-
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:What a- ... that he sees us as sons and daughters
Speaker:... such a relief from having to strive all the time, right?
Speaker:Oh, man.
Speaker:All right, number three.
Speaker:Pay attention to how often water is present and its importance in your daily life and, and let it start to remind you, like the sacrament of your baptism, that you're now immersed and soaked into your true restored Trinitarian identity as a full-fledged member of God's family of missionary servants.
Speaker:And, and we've been sent as disciples of Jesus out into all the little pockets of our own world to make more disciples, filling the world with God's glory.
Speaker:Let water all around us- Yeah ... remind us of that.
Speaker:Just like when we eat, it reminds us of Jesus' life, death, and resurrection, let water remind us of that.
Speaker:Yeah, I love that point, that every... I mean, how much do we deal with water on a daily basis?
Speaker:You wake up, you brush your teeth, you wash your hair, you take a shower, you wash your hands, you wash your vegetables before you eat them.
Speaker:I mean, we're constantly around water, so.
Speaker:So cool.
Speaker:I love it.
Speaker:I mean, just like the meal reminds me of my, you know-
Speaker:Yeah
Speaker:my immersed identity.
Speaker:I mean, uh, my, of Jesus' sacrifice- And, and the new covenant.
Speaker:Yep.
Speaker:Now water can remind me of, of my- Baptism ... immersed baptism.
Speaker:I, oh, I love it.
Speaker:That's beautiful.
Speaker:Okay, if you want those big three takeaways, you get them as a free download by going to everydaydisciple.com/bigthree, and it will come right away to your inbox.
Speaker:If you haven't yet joined our Facebook group, go to Facebook, in the search bar type in Everyday Disciple Podcast.
Speaker:We will let you into the group and won't kick you out unless you become a punk, but it's very easy to get in, and there's an ongoing weekly discussion based off th- that episode.
Speaker:Also, new networks are forming up within there, like people living in different regions saying, "Hey, we're in Fort Worth.
Speaker:Anyone else close?
Speaker:Let's have dinner together." And so we like seeing that growing audience there.
Speaker:Thanks for joining us today.
Speaker:For more information on this show and to get loads of free discipleship resources, visit everydaydisciple.com.
Speaker:And
Speaker:remember, you really can live with the spiritual freedom and relational peace that Jesus promised every day.